Wisdom from the Baron at Gates Of Vienna: The Serbia Standard

One regret that I really have is now that Patriot's Corner has a fair number of followers and is finding its niche, my time for commenting on my favorite sites has really taken a nose dive. It is a sacrifice that I am most willing to make. I am beyond any doubts, a counterjihadist, against islam and sharia law and this site was started as a place for people to become educated about islam, sharia law and upholding what our country was founded and built on, the Constitution of the United States. This site has NEVER been about garnering the highest number of hits or followers. The day I start doing that is the day I will walk away from this and all blogging. So I do not plan on going anywhere and neither is Patriot's Corner.

You are probably thinking what does this have to do with the Serbia Standard (or at least you should be!) Patience, my dear precious, patience.

This all started with a passionate email from a reader in Israel that is included in the next feed. The concerns this person has almost exactly mirrors what my friends that I know in Israel say about how things are in that country. This individual's identity has been left per their request.

This is what it is has to do with the Serbia Standard: The Baron, Dymphna and Gates Of Vienna. Everyone knows that Gates Of Vienna is my favorite site to spend time at, lost of time. I read a lot there. There was recently an outstanding feed posted by by Fjordman on June 9th, last week. I am going to ask that you all do some homework and go read his post and then dive into the comments. Make sure you are sitting down when you start reading some of the comments left in response to Fjordman's superb post. The comments went totally off the track of what Fjordman and his article was REALLY about. It spun right into an assault on the Jews and got ugly. How the Baron and Dymphna responded to all this is without question, superb. I asked for and got permission to re-post the Baron and Dymphna's response here. That is the Serbia Standard. That is the standard that will be used here.

Why am I mentioning this now. The last month or so I have had some comments come in that were nasty and very anti-Semitic, directly so. That will not be tolerated here. I have always welcomed any and all opinions in the comments as long as they hold to the posted guidelines. Comments posted under 'Anonymous' get the boot immediately.

I worked on this post very late last night and stupid blogger had a problem and the entire post was not saved. I was too mad to work it up again last night but today I am mad about other things, so I re-worked the post. Read through the comments (some of them, please) that were left regarding the Serbia Standard.

I also want to suggest that you read some of Fjordmans' previous articles, read some of the following contributors there too. Here are a few, Takuan Seiyo, El Inglés, and Paul Weston.

A very big thanks to Baron and Dymphna at Gates Of Vienna. You are the best!


The Serbia Standard
By Baron Bodissey and Dymphna

As most readers already know, a couple of days ago the comment thread on Fjordman’s essay descended into a Jew-obsessed free-for-all with which we are all too familiar, and which I have come to dread.

Such threads do not change anybody’s mind. They serve no useful purpose, as far as I can tell. People vent at each other for a while, and then the thread peters out, or someone fails to control himself and jumps the perimeter fence, forcing me to close the comments.

Since a lot of the very finest people I work with in the Counterjihad are Jewish conservatives, it does not align with my strategic interests to create any more flypaper for Jew-haters.

For these reasons, I was hesitant about posting anything further on the topic, knowing what is likely to develop in the comments section as a result. But today we received an email appeal from an Israeli woman, and it made me change my mind. I’ll get to that later on in this post, but first let’s talk about Serbia.

Ustasha guard posing amid a pile of bodiesThe subject came up because one of the commenters on the earlier post mentioned Srdja Trifkovic, the Serbian-American historian. Dr. Trifkovic’s history of the Ustasha in Croatia before and during World War 2 is unparalleled. The Jews and the Serbs were corralled together and massacred in the extermination camps of Croatia, with the support (and participation) of a number of Roman Catholic priests and bishops. These are historical facts, thoroughly documented, and Dr. Trifkovic’s work on the topic is exhaustive.

For this reason, I have learned to apply what I call the “Serbia Standard” to those who argue about Israel and the Jews. Anyone who supports Israel (as I do) should also support Serbia for the same reasons. Like the Jews, the Serbs were victims of an attempted extermination during the Second World War. Like the Jews, the Serbs have been unjustly demonized. Like the Jews, the Serbs are under siege by Islam in their own land.

Since the Russians often go to bat for the Serbs, one could even make the case for a vast international conspiracy that works behind the scenes to promote Serbian interests.

Those who are gung-ho about the Jews and Israel but refuse to support the Serbs and Serbia (or who actually vilify them) are intellectually inconsistent and incoherent, so their arguments may be justifiably disregarded.

The Jews now have their own state, as do the Serbs. Both nationalities suffer at the hands of those who would damage or destroy them. Therefore the Jews deserve no more special treatment than do the Serbs, and vice versa.

The Serbia Standard serves as a useful way of weeding out disingenuous and hypocritical arguments by those who support Israel. If they fail to support the Serbs, it exposes their special pleading. I presume it could do the same for anyone who treats Serbia in a similar preferential manner.

Supporting both Serbia and Israel is a useful strategy. So is supporting Finland, Latvia, Romania, Italy, Ireland, Australia, Texas, Virginia, and many other nations that are bastions of Western traditions.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Dymphna and I received the following email this morning from a woman in Israel who has asked to remain anonymous:

Dear Gates of Vienna blog managers (Baron and Dymphna),

I write you from Israel, after reading the latest overheated debate on the “Jewish question”.

Actually, I have followed your blog for some time, in order to get news that is unavailable to the Israeli population (as well as most of the West).

A huge thank you for a priceless work you are doing — from all my heart.

Well, why I decided to write you this convoluted letter at all...

You see, the heated point was very justifiably raised first by certain people about the participation of those enlightened Jews/Jewish organizations in the PC wars enabling the “enrichment”. I won’t argue the fact that they play a relatively big part (based on their population percentage) in the issue, and it’s a point that should be discussed. Shutting it down won’t do any good to anyone, especially to Jews who like me have nothing whatsoever to do with this disastrous campaign.

Nonetheless, I have to admit that the discussion has turned from informative at first to downright ugly. Well, I think you took notice of that — and that’s not why I’m writing to you.

You see, what I wanted to tell is that those Jews and their organizations like George Soros’, or the infamous J-Street, are the mortal enemies of Israel as well — just as they are against the Western traditional world.

Here in Israel the situation is pretty much the same as in Europe or in USA — the radical Left rules in the media and the academy (no matter what the elected government tries to do), and they do everything they can to discredit their own state, including all the usual “enrichment” stuff and all. Anyone who seems even slightly “right” to them is immediately defined as “bigots”, “racists”, “radicals” and so on.

In short — all the usual stuff you’re so familiar with.

I just wanted to explain and stress this important detail that I believe was mostly absent from the discussion —Israel and the Western Traditional world have one common enemy. And this enemy has a lot of radical lefty Jews among them — many of them with power and money. While we, the regular Israeli citizens, don’t have any of that. And they use it against us exactly as they use it against you.

Those who continue to blame all Jews without distinction naïvely/wrongly think those Jewish magnates defend Israel, yet attack and get revenge on the West.. No, they do not. They attack Israel as well, yet they do it while covering their poisonous attacks by disguising them as compatriot help and care (Soros even doesn’t care about the cover-up).

We are desperate...

Please, I just wanted to deliver the message.

I don’t want to go public with it, yet if you want to use this letter because you have to — please, drop my name and let me stay anonymous.

I’m more than happy to deliver this lady’s message. Zenster asked for a thread to discuss this topic, and she has fortuitously helped us to create it.

And I ask all of you to consider the Serbia Standard. Whether for or against, do you apply the same standards to both Serbians and Jews?

I have no time for arguments that fail the Serbia Standard. They lack intellectual rigor.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

Side note: Very few people, except those who have visited Israel and know something about Israeli society, are aware that there are social problems with Jews too who originate in North Africa, and deep divisions in Israel between the Ashkenazi and African-origin Jews from Muslim countries. Takuan Seiyo wrote an article several years ago that outlines some of the issues.

Note from Dymphna

For those readers who intend to reprise the comments thread on Fjordman’s post: resist that temptation.

This post is not about the machinations of the evil Jooooos and their secret conspiracy to gain world dominance. Been there. Done that. Vent somewhere other than on this blog about that subject.

This post concerns the fact that progressive idjits are trying to destroy Israel, and they want to take the rest of the West along on their suicide mission. Are there Joooos in that group? Sure. But they are only part of it.

Instead of pondering the JQ, let’s look at the PQ — the “Progressive Question”— and maybe the fact that so many high-IQ folks can put their intelligence in neutral while they serve an evil cause. Obviously, intellect has little bearing on wisdom or long-term survival with this group.

Sooo…them’s the rules: JQ has been ruled off the turf. There won’t be a repeat of what happened the other day when the comments thread on Fjordman’s post went sideways, much to his distress.

Yes, I know, I know: policing this thread makes me a coward, afraid of free speech. However, the notion of “free speech” never entitles a person to dump whatever they choose on my parlor floor. Such arguments are best left behind in the schoolyard as people mature. At best this unbridled speech is anarchistic.

Gates of Vienna is where we make our living. The comments threads contribute to our character and reputation. It’s a friendly place as long as civility is maintained. Outside our fence, say whatever you want. But inside my front gate the rules are clearly posted.


3 Comments - Share Yours!:

philip.zhao said...

I went through all the 173 comments in response to Serbia Standard and Fjordman's articles in GoV.
Debate seldom solves problems, but while debate gets more heated the truth gets more clear.

PatriotUSA said...

Sometimes it does, sometimes it does not. Either way, in this case the discussion strayed so far from what Fjordman was saying almost all logic was lost in the hornet's nest.

The truth with some of those folks was never in doubt, good or bad. It is quite rare to have a post go tits up like that one did over on G of V.

I know a lot of the commentators
there and have spatted with them many a time. I purposely stayed on the side lines as I saw what was coming maybe before the blog owners did.

HermitLion said...

The letter from that lady describes the facts correctly: most Israelis are actually under attack by Jewish leftist 'elites', much like in the rest of the western world.
The opinions and thoughts of the majority of the Israeli population never get through to other countries.
Furthermore, since common Israelis are attuned to their TV sets, and are unknowingly exposed to the media's indoctrinating propaganda, they are likewise unaware of the true feelings that people abroad have towards them.

Not only is their own institutions targeting them for indoctrination, but they are also constantly told that they are all hated, all the time, solely for the 'petty, fascist, and racist' refusal to give in to muslim demands, and allow the destruction of Israel.